fermenting mead

[elleks]

I started some mead on 14/7/09, along with 2gl of wine.The wine is 'blooping' ok, but the mead is just producing fine bubbles, producing a fine froth on the surface; but not producing enough gas to set the bubbler 'blooping'. I used high alcohol yeast,recommended by my local HB store. Is this OK?

[fatbloke]

I started some mead on 14/7/09, along with 2gl of wine.The wine is 'blooping' ok, but the mead is just producing fine bubbles, producing a fine froth on the surface; but not producing enough gas to set the bubbler 'blooping'. I used high alcohol yeast,recommended by my local HB store. Is this OK?

Which HBS ? Melvins in Worthing (can't remember the exact name....)?

Post the recipe and technique you've used (exact ingredients preferably) and we might be able to work out what's going on......

regards

JtFB

p.s. Just remembered the exact name, it's Johnsons Homebrew in Gratwicke Road.......

[goldseal]

Is your airlock and bung airtight? If it isn't, the CO2 may be escaping elsewheere.

[elleks]

Yes, it was Johnsons who recommended the yeast. I've checked the bung and airlock, and it's tight. the recipe came from H.E.Bravery's book, and was just 2 kg of honey, water to 1 g and yeast. I gave it a good stir, as the honey settled out to start with.

[fatbloke]

Yes, it was Johnsons who recommended the yeast. I've checked the bung and airlock, and it's tight. the recipe came from H.E.Bravery's book, and was just 2 kg of honey, water to 1 g and yeast. I gave it a good stir, as the honey settled out to start with.

Ah, that means that Melvin will have pointed you toward the Youngs "high alcohol/dessert wine" yeast.

That's ok, I made a few batches with that before I started getting mail order Lalvin yeasts.....

What I would say, is that 2kg of honey in the gallon is 4.4lb, that's quite a lot to be getting on with, I'd have suggested nearer the 3 to 3.5 lb per gallon to start with.

What kind of honey did you use ?

Did the recipe suggest anything about nutrients ? as I'm not familiar with the author or the book......

Because without nutrient, honey is famous for being a swine to ferment i.e. very slow as it doesn't naturally have all the nitrogen and other elements that yeast likes.....

Also, acid. Lots suggest a teaspoon of citric or the juice of a lemon. Personally I did use that in the beginning, but I've moved away from that to using the mix suggested in Ashton and Duncans "Making Mead" book (out of print but I got mine from the amazon market place), which is 2 parts Malic to 1 part tartaric. Yeast does like an acid environment.

did you take a gravity measurement from the must before pitching the yeast ? because 3lb of honey in the gallon would give you a measurement of about 1080 to 1090, which is ideal starting so the yeasties don't feel harassed by excessive sugar.

As you may have already guessed, I'm thinking along the lines that it's probably started to ferment, but it is proving a bit on the slow side because of the quite high sugar levels in the must.

The only way this might be a problem, would be that it will take a long time to ferment down and also you will probably have a medicinal taste (Ken Schramm uses the analogy of "Listerine") to it when it does finish.

That's not the problem that it sounds like, it just means that it's "alcohol hot" - and will need ageing to mellow it down.

Does any of that ring bells ?

regards

JtFB

p.s. and don't bin it because it's not proving quite as straight forward as it seems, it does sound like it should finish Ok.

[goldseal]

Beat me to it John - I was just having a look around the rest of the forum for info on mead and nutrients.

I reckon it could be a combination of no nutrient and high SG too.

If there is no nutrient in there, I'd add some, then shake the thing like crazy to get some oxygen into the must.

[fatbloke]

Beat me to it John - I was just having a look around the rest of the forum for info on mead and nutrients.

I reckon it could be a combination of no nutrient and high SG too.

If there is no nutrient in there, I'd add some, then shake the thing like crazy to get some oxygen into the must.

I'd probably do similar Pete, but I'd take a pint or two out of the DJ first, because I've found that staged nutrient addition is worth the effort in meads but it can cause it to foam like hell!

The batch of mixed fruit melomel I've got finishing at the moment, well it was made initially as 1 gallon in a 2 gallon bucket and the swine still managed to foam out of the airlock, at least twice....

ellek might not have the same problem but it could still trigger any CO2 to foam the must after the addition of nutrient giving the "washing up bowl effect" hence the "moving a pint or two out the DJ".

Have you heard of the book/author/recipe ? It's a new one on me....

regards

JtFB

<edit>just had a quick look at amazon for H.E. Bravery and it looks like the "home winemaking" book but it's out of print and there's no reviews </edit>

[goldseal]

I'd probably do similar Pete, but I'd take a pint or two out of the DJ first, because I've found that staged nutrient addition is worth the effort in meads but it can cause it to foam like hell!

Yep, good point. sorry, got distracted by Henry Blofeldt on the cricket commentary. Mad as a box of frogs.

[elleks]

Thanks to all of you. Yes, it's the 'Complete Book of Home Winemaking'- got it for 1p + p&p from Amazon! The recipe included 1/4 oz citric acid, 1/4pt freshly made tea (I did let it cool down!)and a good nutrient (used Tronozymol, 1 tsp) The honey was Smartprice from Asda, and came in 435g pots, so I used 4 of them=1.97kg. Would adding some more nutrient+ a good shake help? The recipe did suggest starting it in a bin, but as it was all liquids I put it straight in the DJ.

[Mel]

I don't even think about drinking my meads until at least a year has passed & I do pretty high honey meads/Cysers, Melomels etc (tea sounds rather um unmeadlike !

Patience is a virtue with mead Honey wise I always go for Aldi or Lidl. Some cheap supermarket honeys are treated/watered and don't make good mead in my experience

[goldseal]

Would adding some more nutrient+ a good shake help? .

EDIT: I have just read your post properly, and you have already added nutrient.

I would (on JTFB's advice) remove some must into a sanitised container, shake the DJ (gently at first, in case of a Wine Volcano), then add the removed must back afterwards.

Let us know how you get on.

[wipka84]

i've seen the addition of tea in a few recipes for mead. I've always added a cup of strong tea to mine. Assume it helps add tannin to aid the longer storage of the stuff to allow it to mellow. have tasted a few early on and none taste of cold tea so dont think that will be a problem.

PS How do you not break into your mead supplies for a whole year!!!!

[fatbloke]

I don't even think about drinking my meads until at least a year has passed & I do pretty high honey meads/Cysers, Melomels etc (tea sounds rather um unmeadlike !

Patience is a virtue with mead Honey wise I always go for Aldi or Lidl. Some cheap supermarket honeys are treated/watered and don't make good mead in my experience

Your spot on with the patience thing Mel, it's handy if like me, you're lazy and take forever before you bottle anything

As for the honey, well there's nothing wrong with using cheaper honey as long as you remember that it will probably have been processed to hell and back, so will have lost a few of the more subtle flavours/aromas.

It does seem, according to various books I've got and other stuff I've read, that if you're aiming for a good "traditional" mead, then the best honey is the strongest tasting, darkest coloured stuff.

If I'm making a melomel/cyser/pyment etc and want the fruit flavour to be the main taste, then I just use cheapo tesco's stuff, if it's either a traditional one or a melomel etc that I want some of the honey flavour coming through then I aim to get the best quality honey I can find/afford.

i've seen the addition of tea in a few recipes for mead. I've always added a cup of strong tea to mine. Assume it helps add tannin to aid the longer storage of the stuff to allow it to mellow. have tasted a few early on and none taste of cold tea so dont think that will be a problem.

Lot's of the older recipes suggest cold tea, it's not for the tea flavour, it's for the tannin. A more up to day recipe would say something like "1 teaspoon of tannin"........

PS How do you not break into your mead supplies for a whole year!!!!

Easy, just make enough of it I've got something like 12 gallons ageing under the stairs.

Plus, it depends on exactly what it is etc, because if it's "alcohol hot", then it does need ageing to get rid of that. Also, sometimes you'll find that it hasn't turned out like you think it should so it just gets left and if need be I use it for blending or topping up.


regards

JtFB

[fatbloke]

Thanks to all of you. Yes, it's the 'Complete Book of Home Winemaking'- got it for 1p + p&p from Amazon! The recipe included 1/4 oz citric acid, 1/4pt freshly made tea (I did let it cool down!)and a good nutrient (used Tronozymol, 1 tsp) The honey was Smartprice from Asda, and came in 435g pots, so I used 4 of them=1.97kg. Would adding some more nutrient+ a good shake help? The recipe did suggest starting it in a bin, but as it was all liquids I put it straight in the DJ.

Ah! well I'm thinking that it might be "sugar shock" then i.e. the book is quite dated and is suggesting a recipe/method that they expected to take a long time to ferment.

4lb of honey in the gallon is quite a lot to start with, it shouldn't be suffering from lack of nutrients as you've already put some tronozymol in it.

So I'd suggest basically as Pete says i.e. take a pint or so out of the DJ, then shake the hell out of it, let it settle a bit and then put the "removed amount" back in.

With a lot of wines you can probably get away with just putting everything into a DJ and letting it rip, honey can be a PITA, so I've move over to either not making a DJ sized batch all the way up to the top so I can give it a good stir/aeration or start the batch in a bucket.

Whether a 3/4 to 4/5 full DJ or a bucket, I mix the must, check the gravity (so I have a guide for how much it might have dropped later) then I pitch the yeast as per the yeast instructions. I stir it at least once a day (but try to remember to do that twice a day if I can). I keep checking the gravity so when it's got to something like 1030 or 1020, then it gets a final stir and it gets put in a DJ to finish with the anaerobic part of the ferment.

If you want to, you can just leave it to do it's thing, which it should do as long as you can see some bubble activity on the top, it'll just take a bit longer to finish.

dunno if that's of any help....

regards

JtFB

[elleks]

Thanks. i've taken some out & shaken it, and put the rest back. i checked the SG while I was doing it, and it's 1.2 approx. Let's see what happens.