How much wine do you plan to make in 2009?

[fatbloke]

Very funny! I got the chilli sauce last time I was in LA... and as I go there fairly often, I stock up when I can.

I did sort of figure that. I used to do that, when I was still in the RN - except I didn't have to worry about transporting liquids or excess baggage allowances. Hence if, like me, your OH is partial to a splash of VVVHCS then it still might be a good idea if you can get the one he likes locally ???

If this is the wine you are referring to John Châteauneuf-du-Pape The wine that is in kit form to be like it is Called Vieux Chateau Duo Roi . This one seems to be popular amoungs U-Brewers.

Just googled it and it seems that various of the online HBS do both the 1 gallon and 5 gallon kits so I'll have to give it a try. Shame that no-one knows of a St. Em' or Margaux clone. I sometimes see a half decent St. Em' in the "offie", but reasonably priced Margaux seems to be in the realms of the occasional "booze cruise". Last one I got was excellent (might have been crap - but I found it very nice) and was €11 (about £8 at the tiime).

Sort of. I assume you're referring to Châteauneuf-du-Pape, but in this instance the "neuf" means "new", and not "nine" - although the spelling is the same.

The word "Châteauneuf" itself is also a French surname that's the equivalent of the English name "Newcastle".

You're correct, however, that it refers to the Pope's manor house or castle. Pope Clement the 5th, who temporarily moved the papacy to Avignon in the 12th century, needed a new manor. The name has stuck to this day.

Yup, was aware of that, but like so many things in French, it's contextural, but amuses my tiny brain to do the literal translations. It always comes out funnier than if it's contexturally correct

regards

JtFB

p.s. Oh and if I get a Vieux Chateau du Roi kit, should it be distilled/de-ionised water or will the local tap stuff suffice ??

[cpfan]

p.s. Oh and if I get a Vieux Chateau du Roi kit, should it be distilled/de-ionised water or will the local tap stuff suffice ??

If the local stuff is drinkable, then it will be fine. OTOH, I don't recommend distilled water (IMHO, distilled water is not drinkable.) Personally I use Reverse Osmosis water, but that's what we drink in our house.

Steve

[fatbloke]

If the local stuff is drinkable, then it will be fine. OTOH, I don't recommend distilled water (IMHO, distilled water is not drinkable.) Personally I use Reverse Osmosis water, but that's what we drink in our house.

Steve

The local stuff is calcium/chalk heavy - very "hard" water (drinkable - it has to be, by law).

I've got kit to distil water, an RO unit will cost me over £150, plus the cost of installing it (just parts etc as I can do that myself).

It's just that I was thinking along the lines of using as neutral a water as possible to try and attain the maximum chance of getting the taste that the makers were aiming for.

The idea being that if I know what's likely to give the best results I can get the kit (when I remember) and get it "fired up" as soon as possible. It'll probably be a 1 gallon kit to start, then if I like it, I'll scale it up for a 5 gallon kit.

TVM for the ideas and suggestions, much appreciated.

regards

JtFB

[cpfan]

JtFB:

YMMV, and I do not know about availability in the UK, but....

Where I get my RO water, it's $10 for a 5 Imperial gallon jug (plus taxes $11.30) plus $2.75 per fill. You can get that down to $2.25 by advance buying 10 fills. (We've gone through 22 fills in 3 months.)

Not sure exactly how much water needs to be added to a 1 gallon kit (4.54 litres), but a local store has 30 500ml bottles for $3 this week.

I'm thinking for one kit, thinking about installing your own RO system is kinda silly. I'll be thinking of you as JtSFB.

Steve

[Richard S]

I can recommend the Beaverdale VCDR kit but the WineExpert version is as you would expect, in a much higher league.

A gallon of water from the supermarket should cost 70 - 80p and you get a free 1 gal fermenting vessel.

[spritzer]

I reckon I will make about 60 gallons this year.... but hopefully I will be a bit more organised about it...
The latter part of the year was a bit of a rush for me... so I will try to avoid that this year



Oh... And I am glad that I live in an area where the tap water is "good".
When I lived in London, I always had to buy water to drink, as the tap water, although they said it was drinkable... it tasted nasty.
I think, for the amount that it rains here, I would feel a bit seen off if I had to buy drinkable water

[fatbloke]

-----%<-----
Oh... And I am glad that I live in an area where the tap water is "good".
When I lived in London, I always had to buy water to drink, as the tap water, although they said it was drinkable... it tasted nasty.
I think, for the amount that it rains here, I would feel a bit seen off if I had to buy drinkable water

Tap water here is much the same as the London area i.e. hard and chalky.

The outlaws come from around Lancaster, and still moan about the difference it water taste - probably because up round there it comes through granite, not chalk.

Oh and even down here, it's been confirmed a number of times, that the water's cleaner than the stuff bought in bottles.

Water is water as far as I'm concerned. It has to be clean enough by law. I was just wondering about using it for wine/mead etc as even something as basic as chalk/calcium could, in theory, change the taste.

If it's a basic recipe and I'm collecting the ingredients I'm not fussed, but if I'm paying "good dollar" for a kit, I'd want it to taste as close to how the makers intended it to be, hence my Q's.

HNY one and all.

regards

JtFB

p.s. @ cpfan, I only know the price of a basic RO setup because of my fish. It was a case of wondering whether it would work out cheaper than the £3.50 for a 25 litre fill up, but it would take some time to recoup the money even for the fish and the brewing so I might just get a can from them if/when I try the VCDR kit.

[rjb222]

John I do not know if you know about some of the problems that have occurred over here but even with laws certain individuals have contaminated water systems under government control.It has taught me to be very skeptical and not trusting of what should be assumed as safe.I use filtered water as the levels of ph and hardness etc. are controlled.This creates a good situation for recipes as everything is consistent.Certain brews say an IPA will benefit from hard water but in most cases lower hardness levels are better for the brew.

[Her Lushness]

Personally speaking, when I lived in London I used filtered water, and up here in the Midlands, I still use filtered water for drinking as the water is very hard up here.

I have very little faith in the water companies claims that our drinking water is safe to drink - especially after sitting in meetings with Anglian Water's head honchos discussing Business Continuity and how well they risk assess their everyday duties!

For winemaking I buy bottled water - at around 90p for 5 litres I think it's well wort it to reduce the risk of bad tasting brewings.

[Mamgiowl]

[QUOTE=Her Lushness;47764]

For winemaking I buy bottled water - at around 90p for 5 litres I think it's well wort it to reduce the risk of bad tasting brewings.[/QUOTE]

I think in this country the water is perfectly safe by and large, but if you do go down this road, at least you can use the container as a DJ. I have about 10 of them, having drilled a hole in the lid to take a grommet and an airlock, and they're brilliant. I've kept a couple of lids undrilled which I use when shaking the bejaysus out of the wine to degas it, also made easier because they are not so heavy as glass

[NorthernWiner]

If you can drink the water, it's fine for winemaking. However, I remember Tim Vandergrift (Winemaker mag & WE technical mgr) saying that artificially softened water should be avoided, although I don't recall why.

My drinking water contains so much chlorine it tastes like a swimming pool. Therefore I generally make kits using store-bought distilled water.

[fatbloke]

John I do not know if you know about some of the problems that have occurred over here but even with laws certain individuals have contaminated water systems under government control.It has taught me to be very skeptical and not trusting of what should be assumed as safe.I use filtered water as the levels of ph and hardness etc. are controlled.This creates a good situation for recipes as everything is consistent.Certain brews say an IPA will benefit from hard water but in most cases lower hardness levels are better for the brew.

It's more of a case of varying levels of "hardness" Robert. There's so much oversight, albeit government regulation, or even environmental groups etc that in truth it's not so much of a problem.

The only issue that's raised it's head in the past few years has been "leaching" of fertilizer residues i.e. nitrates and phosphates. Though even that's been regulated to hell now (plus I tend to do periodic water tests for my fish anyway).

It was the "consistency" thing that was mainly in my mind. It's no hardship to distil some water, well enough to make a gallon or five anyway. That way I'm only dealing with pH and other issues from the main ingredients.

Personally speaking, when I lived in London I used filtered water, and up here in the Midlands, I still use filtered water for drinking as the water is very hard up here.

I have very little faith in the water companies claims that our drinking water is safe to drink - especially after sitting in meetings with Anglian Water's head honchos discussing Business Continuity and how well they risk assess their everyday duties!

For winemaking I buy bottled water - at around 90p for 5 litres I think it's well wort it to reduce the risk of bad tasting brewings.

Well I can't think of any reason why a little bit of scepticism could do you any harm.

The problem I see with filtration type kit (I'm sure lots of us have seen the adverts) is that they producers fail to disclose exactly how it's supposed to work, other than at least one element of the filter cartridges i.e. "activated carbon".

If that's what you prefer then excellent.

As for bottled water, well, you'll notice that some of it has alleged health claims. Plus I notice that they only ever put what "might" be good for you on the label, and nothing about how often they test it to make sure that the bottling source is clean/safe etc. Of course that's probably just a PR thing, because they have to test the water source by law, but wouldn't want to tell you about that just in case it frightens you away from buying a particular brand.

It's a bit like the "fluoride debate". Yes, it has some benefit, but is it sensible to make it an additive in the water ? I understand that it's basically a waste product, but if "they" need us to have some for genuine health (dental mainly as I understand it) reasons, then why not have cheap or free fluoride tablets ? then it's down to individual choice and won't affect those who have negative health issues with it.

Some of the bottled water I use, I know where the spring it, I even know the people who bottle it, but they don't do anything else with it (other than test it etc). So how can I be sure that it's safe when it comes out of the ground ? Exactly, I can't.

Hence my Q's and that if nothing else, RO is probably fine (especially if you RO filter it yourself to be sure) or distilled as all the contaminantes of whatever kind (natural or artificial) are left in the kit.

If you can drink the water, it's fine for winemaking. However, I remember Tim Vandergrift (Winemaker mag & WE technical mgr) saying that artificially softened water should be avoided, although I don't recall why.

My drinking water contains so much chlorine it tastes like a swimming pool. Therefore I generally make kits using store-bought distilled water.

All our public water supply has a limited amount of chlorine/chloramine in it. Though it's generally imperceptible. There's still enough for me to use additives in it before I'll use it for the fish!

The artificially softened water thing is to do with the small amount of sodium chloride (yup, that's salt to we mere mortals) that's added to soften it.

It guess that his suggestion is probably because of the potential for taste problems in the wine or problems conducting the ferment. I doubt whether the yeast likes seasoning on it's dinner

All this has definitely got me thinking about making sure I only use RO or distilled water for my wine and mead making though! If for no other reason, than consistency.

regards

JtFB

[rjb222]

Ro filtered water is what I use in the U-Brew I had it installed when I opened up. It is just that I find it is consistently good water with the proper ph etc.

[spritzer]

For winemaking I buy bottled water - at around 90p for 5 litres I think it's well wort it to reduce the risk of bad tasting brewings.

I agree... and if my local water tasted as bad as "Peckahm Spring" then I would do the same....

But the water outta my tap is lovely...... Better than most supermarkets "Scottish" bottled water

[cpfan]

John:

almost as good as your own RO system, is a very good water store about two blocks away. I've had a couple of good chats with the owner (he has 3 stores) and even had a quick tour of the local store. As far as I can tell, he runs the store even better than I would if it was my store. For example, he had a company that specializes in stainless steel tanks for wineries make his storage tanks. Most stores use plastic.

Steve