Adding Oak Chips?

[happymondays]

I am doing a cyser (Fall's Bounty) at the moment and was wondering whether to add some Oak chips to the secondary when it has finished to see what it tastes like, ( I know it is going to be oaky) I will have 2 one gallon DJ's of this as its a trial to see if I like it and plan to do a bigger batch.
So I was just wondering do I need to get any particular type of chips is one better than the other kind of thing and how much would you use for one gallon?
Also I was going to add maybe some cinnamon and or ginger or something else, I suppose I am just experimenting with some spices so if anyone has some good combinations for a cyser that work well would be good.
Plus if anyone has some good cyser recipes I could try I would be very grateful.

Best regards Scott.......

p.s. the Go-Ferm and Fermaid-K has this foaming like a good un just lucky for me this is my first batch of using a primary right through to 1.030 ish

[silverfox]

Hi, I have never made a Mead before but have used Honey in lots of my wines.
Would love to try a simple Mead or Cyser recipe.
You mentioned "Go-Ferm and Fermaid-K" where did you get them from & do you think they have made a difference to the fermentation?

Silverfox

[fatbloke]

I am doing a cyser (Fall's Bounty) at the moment and was wondering whether to add some Oak chips to the secondary when it has finished to see what it tastes like, ( I know it is going to be oaky) I will have 2 one gallon DJ's of this as its a trial to see if I like it and plan to do a bigger batch.
So I was just wondering do I need to get any particular type of chips is one better than the other kind of thing and how much would you use for one gallon?
Also I was going to add maybe some cinnamon and or ginger or something else, I suppose I am just experimenting with some spices so if anyone has some good combinations for a cyser that work well would be good.
Plus if anyone has some good cyser recipes I could try I would be very grateful.

Best regards Scott.......

p.s. the Go-Ferm and Fermaid-K has this foaming like a good un just lucky for me this is my first batch of using a primary right through to 1.030 ish

Well I've been using oak chips for some other things Scott, but it seems to depend on how much oaky taste you want.

Of the two packs I've tried one was from "Ritchies", I don't recall exactly, but it said something about putting it (actually it looks like saw dust) in the must for X amount of time. There was some info on the packet.

The other one I tried was medium toasted oak chips (again, like saw dust) but it didn't say much on that packet.

It's my understanding that French Oak is supposed to be the better one too use.

Plus I seem to remember reading stuff about using oak in some of Bob's posts, so you might try searching for his info.

Or maybe you could just get a half barrel from the local garden centre and make oak cubes from that (I haven't tried that it's just an idea)???

Hi, I have never made a Mead before but have used Honey in lots of my wines.
Would love to try a simple Mead or Cyser recipe.
You mentioned "Go-Ferm and Fermaid-K" where did you get them from & do you think they have made a difference to the fermentation?

Silverfox

Difficult to get in the UK but there's a seller called "Nashwoodwinery" on ebay (in the US). From what Scott has said, they do work out a bit dearer than something like tronozymol, but it seems like good kit.

Whether it makes any difference ? I can't say until I've tried it (yes I'm intending to order some myself).

regards

JtFB

p.s. There's a recipe that I did a tutorial on for a basic/traditional mead. I used the "sweet" suggestion, but it seems that the recommendation of 4lb of honey to the gallon gives you a very high (relatively) gravity. So I'd suggest that if you wanted to give it a go, then mix maybe 2 or 3 lb of honey into 3/4 of a gallon water and then check the gravity.

Lot's here suggest a starting gravity of about 1080/1090, so if you started from that, you can always check out the alcohol tolerance of the yeast you're intending to use, then when the gravity has reduced down to 1030 or so, add some more honey, say up to a gravity of 1050 or 1060 (maybe a little nutrient as well).

Same again when it gets back down to the 1030 mark, then leave it to finish.

As for yeast? my current favourite is Lalvin 71B-1122 and if you can't find that, then send Bob a PM he can supply it.

[Rich]

There's a seller called "Nashwoodwinery" on ebay (in the US).

I've used him, very helpful. Took about 2 weeks or so for delivery.

Rich

[fatbloke]

Scott,

dunno if the attached .pdf is helpful at all ?

regards

JtFB

[Duffbeer]

Or maybe you could just get a half barrel from the local garden centre and make oak cubes from that (I haven't tried that it's just an idea)???

Not advisable here John, many of the 1/2 barrels in garden centres are made for decorative purposes as planters, the chances of them being made from American, French or Hungarian oak is a very small one, not an avenue I would persue.

[Mamgiowl]

Not advisable here John, many of the 1/2 barrels in garden centres are made for decorative purposes as planters, the chances of them being made from American, French or Hungarian oak is a very small one, not an avenue I would persue.

Plus they would have preservative in/on them.

Creosote wine, anyone?

[happymondays]

Hi, I have never made a Mead before but have used Honey in lots of my wines.
Would love to try a simple Mead or Cyser recipe.
You mentioned "Go-Ferm and Fermaid-K" where did you get them from & do you think they have made a difference to the fermentation?

Silverfox

Hi Silverfox,

I have done a few experiments with "natural nutrients" with some success compared with chemical nutrients and found that the chemical varieties do finish quicker, I have been using Lalvin Yeasts so they recommend using Go-Ferm for re-hydration of their yeasts and Fermaid-K for nutrients along with generic DAP in certain types of musts and at the moment I am trying to find a schedule that works as there seems to be personal preference as to whether to use just Fermaid-K on its own or with conjunction with DAP in staggered additions depending on whether you are using fruit, Light honey, Dark Honey. I have only just got these Nutrients from the U.S. and have just started a Cyser using these and to be honest the foaming that has appeared is something I haven't seen before so it will be interesting to see how it finishes.
Some info here http://www.brewboard.com/index.php?showtopic=60156

I honestly think yes they have made a difference although it is a bit early yet as ferment is still going and will let you know how the Cyser turns out, as posted Nashwood Winery was the only place I could find on Ebay that did these but if you search Google.com there are quite a few US shops that stock it but some with quite expensive shipping rates.

http://cgi.ebay.com/Fermaid-K-8oz_W0...2em118Q2el1247


I did contact Lallemend in the UK but they would only sell in bulk I think the smallest was either 1 or 2 kg sizes and they never got back with a price, if you want the number I could PM you.

Regards Scott......

Scott,

dunno if the attached .pdf is helpful at all ?

regards

JtFB

Cheers John will have a look at that, I did a search using "oak" but couldn't find anything unless I did something wrong, I will have a look at the French Oak, just wasn't sure how much to use.

Regards Scott.....

I've used him, very helpful. Took about 2 weeks or so for delivery.

Rich

Sounds about the same time Rich no taxes to pay either they put it down as a gift so bypassing our tax system

[Duffbeer]

Cheers John will have a look at that, I did a search using "oak" but couldn't find anything unless I did something wrong, I will have a look at the French Oak, just wasn't sure how much to use.

Scott, the main thing to remember about oak is firstly make sure you have the right stuff, using any old wood is going to ruin your wine/mead. The main usable oak's that spring to my mind are American white oak which I find great for white wines such as chardonnay or pinot grigio. The other is French oak medium or heavy toast, best in my opinion for red wines, the other oak that springs to mind is Hungarian oak which I've never used so can't comment. I do believe that most oak users have the same feeling of a little to start with and add more if needed.
Oak is a fantastic addition to some wines and can vastly improve it's flavour and bouquet, but an over oaked wine can be very astringent and overpowering.
I have found that oak in the primary gives more oakiness but requires less addition, oak in the maturation stages takes longer, but is probably more rewarding in flavour complexity.
My personal advise is to add a little at the start and taste at regular intervals making your final decision yourself..you can put more in but you can't take it out.

[rjb222]

Oak saw dust vs. chips or staves

Oak saw dust has a tendancey to loose it's flavor quickly. I belive this is due to exposure to air there is actually a larger percentage of surface area exposed in a piece of sawdust than in chips, chunks or staves.The bigger the piece of oak the less area is exposed the better the flavoring from the oak. Also if you are going to use oak that you have around do not use anything that has been sold to you from a lumber yard there will be chemicals sprayed on to prevent moisture. rot and insects from attacing these boards. Use air dried lumber only. Using an old barrel is not usually good either as the reason these barrels have been sold by the winery is they do not have any oak flavor left usuall called a neutral barrel IE. half barrels found at gardening centers.

[lockwood1956]

Would love to try a simple Mead or Cyser recipe.
You mentioned "Go-Ferm and Fermaid-K" where did you get them from & do you think they have made a difference to the fermentation?

Silverfox

Paul you can get Fermaid, under a different brand name, from a brupaks stockist its called minavit ultra

http://www.brupaks.com/stockists.html

Ill stick some in a little tub for next time we meet...im not at lincoln show (on holiday) but my wines will be there....remind me nearer time and ill give some to Karl to bring for you

regards
Bob

[happymondays]

Scott, the main thing to remember about oak is firstly make sure you have the right stuff, using any old wood is going to ruin your wine/mead. The main usable oak's that spring to my mind are American white oak which I find great for white wines such as chardonnay or pinot grigio. The other is French oak medium or heavy toast, best in my opinion for red wines, the other oak that springs to mind is Hungarian oak which I've never used so can't comment. I do believe that most oak users have the same feeling of a little to start with and add more if needed.
Oak is a fantastic addition to some wines and can vastly improve it's flavour and bouquet, but an over oaked wine can be very astringent and overpowering.
I have found that oak in the primary gives more oakiness but requires less addition, oak in the maturation stages takes longer, but is probably more rewarding in flavour complexity.
My personal advise is to add a little at the start and taste at regular intervals making your final decision yourself..you can put more in but you can't take it out.

Cheers Karl,

I will have a go in the secondary in small doses see how it goes, you wouldn't know anywhere I could get them just done a quick search but cant find anyone that sells them. My local HB shop doesnt have them either,

Regards Scott......

[lockwood1956]

Scott
Leyland home brew will have them for sure...they do mail oder too!

http://www.leylandhomebrew.co.uk

hope this helps
if you get stuck, give us a shout

regards
Bob

[lockwood1956]

here you go

http://www.leylandhomebrew.com/item865.htm

[happymondays]

Cheers Bob I do use them as they are the nearest that seem to do almost everything but I swear I couldn't find the Oak Chips on their site this morning but there you have it thanks Bob I will have a trip down,

Best regards Scott.....