Thread for questions and discussion on new winemaker series

[Leon]

That sounds like a plan Lockwood, it is exatly what I'll do. You mentioned the flavours being blown out of the airlock, well I've got it in my bucket at the moment, would you add the damsons once it's in the Demi John or add them to the bucket?

Hell, you may as well come over and do it for me!

Thank you kindly.

[PCJARVIS]

Wine Number 1 Variants

Bob, in your 19-07-2008 update on Wine Number 1 you introduced a tablespoon of fresh elder flowers. How do you know how much to add to make a wine that has the flavour of your additive? And what additive flavours can you recommend for this method? Paul

[lockwood1956]

Bob, in your 19-07-2008 update on Wine Number 1 you introduced a tablespoon of fresh elder flowers. How do you know how much to add to make a wine that has the flavour of your additive? And what additive flavours can you recommend for this method? Paul

experimentation is the key, you dont need much addition as the alcohol extracts the smell/flavour very well, so less is more, one can always make a 2nd addition, just remember, once its in....it's in

regards
Bob

[SiSandrine]

And what additive flavours can you recommend for this method? Paul

I have tried Elderflowers (fresh), Gooseberries (tinned), Strawberries and Blueberries (fresh and if backsweetened afterwards) with good effect. My Elderflower and Gooseberry together as a late addition to Wine Number 1 was quite similar to a (French) Sauvignon Blanc i.e. subtle tropical fruit.

Others will have other experiences but you can really try almost anything (even tinned fruits) with this method. I believe Raspberries can be overpowering on their own and if not carefully added (haven't tried myself).

Fortunately, nobody has invented tinned parsnips yet . If they do, I won't be trying that.

Many Thanks

[robwrx]

My Elderflower and Gooseberry together as a late addition to Wine Number 1 was quite similar to a (French) Sauvignon Blanc i.e. subtle tropical fruit.

Simon

I'm interested in knowing what volume/weight of both was used and for how long? I'm rather partial to a drop of sav blanc

Regards
Rob

[SiSandrine]

Hi Rob,

Pete (Goldseal) was the inspiration - I think he won awards with his. My innovation was the addition of fresh Elderflowers.

1 gallon recipe went like

1lt apple juice
1lt pressed white grape
1tsp tronozymol
1 tsp Citric Acid.
1 tsp bentonite
Sugar to 1.080 for me that was 700g sugar (in syrup)
1tsp pectolase
1 tsp yeast nutrient
Gervin No 5
8 grams fresh elderflowers only.
307grams goosberries in syrup (Jar Hartleys Gooseberries).
1/4 tsp grape tannin.

Followed WN1 recipe. When SG was 1.010 I added the Elderflowers and Gooseberries.

I left them in for 10 days then racked off, fermented out and fined with Kwik Clear. Until that point it tasted flat, watery but then taste started to come round. I have now blended it into another wine which lacked a little flavour otherwise I would have bought some this weekend. It was so simple to do that I figured easy to do again. I will have to use Elderflower cordial though if I do it before next spring. If you wanted more tropical fruit flavour e.g. kiwi style maybe you could add a mix of gooseberries and say pineapple or maybe a kiwi.

See you on Saturday.

[Leon]

Help!

OK, I had a bit of a moment and seriously over sugared a must, it was 1102. Is this ruined, I've left it to ferment while I ponder what to do with it, but unfortunately pondering is getting me nowhere. Can anybody help?

[robwrx]

Thanks for the recipe Simon, I shall add it to my to do list over the winter. I have got some frozen Elderflowers that I can use but I might also try cordial.

Cheers
Rob

[goldseal]

OK, I had a bit of a moment and seriously over sugared a must, it was 1102. Is this ruined, I've left it to ferment while I ponder what to do with it, but unfortunately pondering is getting me nowhere. Can anybody help?

That's a challenge!

you haven't said what the must actually was, but let's assume it's a Wine No.1 or No.2.

You could make another gallon of must, then mix the two to get approximately the correct SG.

If you convert SGs to grammes-per-litre of sugar, the maths are straightforward.

1.102 is 270 grammes per litre of sugar. In a gallon that's around 1215g.

Let's assume you were aiming for 1.080, which is 208gl, or 936g in a gallon.

If you had 2 gals, you'd need 1872g of sugar to get 1.080. You already have 1215g in your gallon, so you need an extra 657g.

657g in a gallon is 146gl, which is 1.055.

So, I'd make up a gallon of your must, but be VERY careful with sugar additions, and aim for 1.055. You'll need to add everything except yeast. Allow the temperature of the new must to get close to that of the fermenting one, then mix 50/50. Let them ferment out, and process them as normal.

With any luck, both will end up decent wines.

[Leon]

, the maths are straightforward.

In whose world was that cavalcade of numbers straight forward? Not mine.
Don't think badly of me, but I skipped straight to the punchline. I'll put my dunce cap on and go back to the numbers later. My problem with your solution is two fold: I don't have anymore demi jones to make it into two gallons, and the must was damsons, which are dropping off the trees like, well, ripe fruit, so I'm not sure if I can get enough must to make two gallons. The former is the bigger of the problems.

So is there no solution that involves keeping it at one gallon. What would happen if I tried? I'm assuming the high sugar levels will kill off the yeast, but what if I just keep adding more yeast until it reaches below 1000?

If no wine comes out of this, at least I've learnt to be a bit more precise.

[Rich]

Emergency demijons are sold at the supermarket, they look just like 5 litre mineral water containers. They even come with 5 litres of water in them.

A quick drill in the top to fit an airlock, and you're away.

[goldseal]

My problem with your solution is two fold: I don't have anymore demi jones to make it into two gallons, and the must was damsons, which are dropping off the trees like, well, ripe fruit, so I'm not sure if I can get enough must to make two gallons. The former is the bigger of the problems.

Sorry Leon, in the absence of any other information I assumed the problem related to one of the Wine Number n wines, for this is the thread to discuss those wines.

Adding more yeast won't help. The problem is toxicity - yeast don't like alcohol, and will start to die out once a certain alcohol level is reached (different for each yeast). It won't matter whether there are a thousand yeast cells active, or a few billion, they'll still die.

One of two thing will happen: if the yeast can cope with the alcohol, it may ferment to dry, and you'll end up with a wine around 15%. If the yeast die early, you'll end up with a little residual sweetness in the wine.

If the wine gets to 14 - 15% alcohol, you may find that it tastes 'hot'. At that point you can either leave it to age, and hope it smooths out over time (probably years), or you could try sweetening it (after stabilising), which will have the effect of balancing out the alcohol (think Port - 19 or 20%, but it doesn't taste like that because it is sweet). You'll probably need to add acid too, to stop it becoming 'flabby' as you add sweetness.

Apologies for the maths. I probably didn't lay it out too well, but a bit of multiplication and division is about as straightforward as I can make it

[Leon]

I did work out the maths, wth a sweat dappled, furrowed brow, I worked my way through it, as I've said to many a woman - its not you, its me.

Thank you for your help, I'll keep a close eye on preceedings and try and acuire another demi john. The five litre bottle of water sounds like a plan.

[goldseal]

[Smiggs]

Hi All,
I was going to try a #2 but could not get blueberry juice so went for 2x red grape + 1 apple. Also got no tannin so thought instead i'd try a #1 with this juice. Used 1lb sugar for sg of 1.08.

Just racked for the first time, now at 0.994. I had a taste and its good but pretty sour. Is this normal at this stage?

I'm now thinking maybe I should sorbate and sweeten as in #2. What do you think?

Cheers,
Matt