Sulphite odour when bottling....

[hcostin]

Hi, I read Omniata's post on a similar theme and I think I too may have over sulphited (but maybe not as much) I used the Selection kit, as usual flawless process up to final clarification, then as suggested by the instructions (if I wanted to store some for > 6 months, I fancy laying a couple of bottles down until Xmas 2010), I added sodium metabisuphite powder (the kit suggested potassium metabisulphite but I had Ritchies Camden Powder) - the tub says 2.5g per 4.5 litres. I assumed 22.5 litres would be bottled so added 12.5g diluted in a cup of water, but in reality allowing for wastage at the bottom of first rack I ended up with 19-20 litres. But there is a sulphite odour to the wine I noticed at the time I bottled it on Monday. I checked the scales I used and have a suspicion they were inaccurate and measured the same amount again last night - using a measuring spoon I reckon there is actually 6 teaspoonfuls in there. From what I can read elsewhere that is the equivalent of 6 camden tablets.... Is the wine fit for nothing but the drain now? I have read that degassing the wine might help - any advice would be much appreciated before I pour £65 and 6 weeks patience down the plughole... many thanks.. Haydn C

[lockwood1956]

EEK!


I believe you are a little way out........


1.25g per 23 litres is what I add (1/4 tsp per 5 gallons) that is measured as pure Potassium Metabisulphite powder....I think you are one decimal point out i.e. you have added ten times what is required!!!!!!(0.25g per 4.5 litres)



but fear not, you can get rid of it as Omniata (Jim) managed to do

[Duffbeer]

Just as a side note, Ritchi's campden powder is not pure sulphite, it is a diluted form made to replace campden tablets, ie: 1 tsp of Ritchi's campden powder = 1 campden tablet.
At my reckoning 2.5g of campden powder is equivilent to 5 campden tablets, I feel this is about right if it's going to be stored for 12 to 18 months, it may smell a tad sulphite heavy at the moment but should become free so2 over a period of storing.

[rjb222]

One does need to test this I believe. I had one customer that did not rinse the pads out with potable water before filtering his wine this had a smell of sulfite. The test came back and I quote in the same way it was sent to me.(DO NOT DRINK. POISION!) Although there was never a total amount of so2 retuned with this wine I now allways error on the side of caution when some one says they notice a sulfite smell.

[lockwood1956]

Just as a side note, Ritchi's campden powder is not pure sulphite, it is a diluted form made to replace campden tablets, ie: 1 tsp of Ritchi's campden powder = 1 campden tablet.

well you learn something new every day

cheers dude

[ms67]

i only use ritchies campden powder in airlocks and for sanitising kit ready to brew with. The reason is that i haven't got a clue what it is and find it very annoying. There is no list of ingredients/component chemicals, and the volumes dont add up if it were just sodium/potasium meta..... when i first used it i too found that the smell was very strong and assumed the label was wrongly printed (decimal point out) but didnt want to risk my brews with an assumption.

so cheers for the info, i use lots of ritchies stuff and generally have no complaints with it, but i do wish they would tell us what else is in their powder.

edit .... i spent a lot of time sloshing the smelly wine about to drive off the smell when bottles were opened. it worked ok, but kinda ruined the experience, and having to tell folks who got a bottle as a gift can't have been confidence inspiring!

[NorthernWiner]

I was also wondering what the inert ingredients are in this powder.

Whatever it is, it would seem to make up a large percentage of the product. I'm not sure I would want a lot of unknown "stuff" in my wine. If you're going to go to all the trouble, it seems like it would be just as easy to weigh out pure metabisulphite powder.

[Duffbeer]

Unfortunately it doesn't state anything on the tub, just simply 'campden powder', the reason for this is that Ritchi's cannot supply campden tablets, so presume this is something they have developed themselves to suffice ?? Thus trying to keep things simple or making up profit wise, it would be more practicle to sell a ready made 10% solution....

Now there's an idea

[ms67]

Unfortunately it doesn't state anything on the tub, just simply 'campden powder', the reason for this is that Ritchi's cannot supply campden tablets, so presume this is something they have developed themselves to suffice ?? Thus trying to keep things simple or making up profit wise, it would be more practicle to sell a ready made 10% solution....

Now there's an idea

is this a patent thing ... campden tablets?

[Duffbeer]

Not 100% sure, but am guessing the manufacturer of campden tablets only supplies Young's and refuses to supply Ritchi's.
There has be a massive fallout between Uk HB suppliers, so they are refusing to supply each other goods which they have in the past ?? have no idea why??

[fatbloke]

Not 100% sure, but am guessing the manufacturer of campden tablets only supplies Young's and refuses to supply Ritchi's.
There has be a massive fallout between Uk HB suppliers, so they are refusing to supply each other goods which they have in the past ?? have no idea why??

no I don't think that's the case.....

It's more likely to be a contractual thing i.e. that one "tablet presser" is contractually tied to only supply one company with the identical product.

Either way, there's plenty of contract tablet pressers, but I'm thinking that it's more likely to be about the cost effectiveness of producing small runs of something that probably comes under the food reg's, with no guaranteed amount of sales.

They could probably only do that if they got a small pill press and make the tablets as they go along. Though there's bound to be other compliance requirements than mean it's not cost effective...

again, just my 2pence worth....

regards

jtfb

[ms67]

thanks for the thoughts/theories

there does seem to be a lot of discontent among those in the trade. all a bit mad really, a recession is a great opportunity homebrew suppliers, and bickering doesnt seem to me to be a good way of making the most of it. but i guess its all a bit more complicated than it looks from the outside

[hcostin]

Thanks

Thankyou for everyone's responses to my thread. I also exchanged a couple of emails with a very helpful lady at Ritchies, who advised that given the proportions of their powder used (thanks to the duffbeer's post, I now know that Camden powder is a different beast to potassium metabisulphite!), the sulphite odour will go with time and if not decanting the wine before serving and leaving to stand will also help - I've decided to leave the wine in the bottles and take a look in a couple of months' time. Incidentally, Ritchies' view is that you don't really need to add any sulphite to higher end kit wines if you want to store them for 6 months or more....

[ms67]

so what did the helpful ritchies folk say was in their camden power?

[hcostin]

She didn't actually say - I just outlined the proportions I had used powder vs wine, and she passed comment on what to do.