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  • Gitface's Yeast trial

    Hi All

    In my first few wines I've been using Young Super Yeast as I bought the tub before find this site. Anyway I decided that I'd give some of the other yeast a try, so the plan is to try some small batches and see how they come out.

    The test bed will be based on wine number 1 made from pure grape.

    Yeast under test: Lalvin D47, Gervin Varietal 'D', Gervin No. 2 and Young's Super.

    To ensure equal test conditions I made up a start as per the tutorial section, for this I used a litre of apple juice add the adjusted sugar, nutrient and acid and heated this up to sanitise as per instructions. This was then cooled and shared out between four 500ml bottles and yeast pitched, tops covered to keep bugs out and put to one side.

    Observation:

    The two gervin seemed to spread through the starter solution quickly turning it a light cream colour and showing strong signs of fermenting, the Lalvin also showed this same cream colour but not a light with only slight signs of ferment, the Youngs while no were near as cloudy as the others showed sign of a strong ferment.

    Just over 12 hours later the Gervin No2 had produced a head up to the top, so ~250ml of foam. Varietal 'D' had a head but not as big and the youngs also had a head. The D47 had very little foaming. I did notice that the bubble were a lot smaller than the other three. So left them for another 12 hours before pitching into the main Must.

    For the Must I made this from 2 litres of aldi white grape juice and made this up to 4 litres and a SG of 1.080, having observed the amount of foam produced I shared this out to four 1 litre fermenters, this was done by adding 2/3 rds of the starter then topping up with the Must and airlock fitted. One thing I did not take into consideration is that by creating the starter I was going to add ~200ml of this to the Must, with not topping all the way up, this left me with a litre left, Doh!, so in a bottle and to the fridge it went.

    To make sure I got all the yeast from the starters I put a lid on and gave them a shake to ensure they were well mixed, expecting to release so CO2 I was prepared when taking the top off, all went according to plan until I did the D47 which blow the top off as I loosened it and filled the bottle with a fine foam, so I'm guessing that with the smaller bubbles that the starter was absorbing a lot more CO2 than the others, this will have to be something to take note of at the de-gassing stage.

    It's now been a day since adding the starter to the Musts and all are fermenting Nicely.

    Lalvin D47: This was the last to show activity in the air lock and is bubbling the slowest, no head to speak of.

    Gervin No2: Started up like a rocket, was bubbling away in less than 30 minutes with a good rate, good sized head has formed but looks to be dropping.

    Gervin Varietal 'D': This was the third to start bubbling but now going at a good rate, head has formed but not as big as the No2.

    Young's: Started up not much longer after the No2 with as much vigour. Looks like the head rose high enough to get into the airlock, woke up this morning to see it just starting to come out the top and stop it going all over.

    Will top them all up in a day or two when I'm sure they have settled down a bit then test SG a few days later.

    Mark.............

  • #2
    No bread yeast thrown in another one to see what it can do?


    Although this book is more orientated to beer brewing, it's a fantastic (in depth) read on yeast : http://www.amazon.co.uk/dp/0937381969

    I've read it through a few times now, and I've even understood a few bits!

    Comment


    • #3
      Looking forward to the results!

      Comment


      • #4
        Rich: I'll have a look in to that book what with xmas just round the corner.

        Just an update, tested the sg of each batch and this is what I got:

        Young: SG - 0.993. Some gas as I poured it in to the trial jar and a fast bubble. Very little activity in the airlock.

        Gervin No. 2: SG - 0994. Quite a bit of gas given off as I poured it in to the jar. gave a rapid ferment with lots of bubbles. Very little activity in the airlock.

        Gervin Varietal 'D': SG - 1.000. Lots of gas from this one and while is was a rapid ferment not as fast as the No. 2. Still reasonable amount of bubble from airlock.

        Lalvin D47: SG - 1.035. Slow to start but has maintained a steady rate since. This had the most gas trapped and pouring it in to the jar filled it with foam at about 35/75 liquid/foam.

        As a note all the bottle are grouped together so there is going to be little temperature difference to effect fermentation rate.

        All have now been topped up and will wait for them to finish and clear and have a taste test.

        A Hypothesis: The more rapid the ferment the more chance that flavours will be blown out the airlock, does this sound right?

        Mark.............

        Comment


        • #5
          A Hypothesis: The more rapid the ferment the more chance that flavours will be blown out the airlock, does this sound right?
          Are you correlating speed of ferment with temperature? Cooler temperatures tend to keep more flavour & fragrance than hotter ones.
          There is also an argument that says a given amount of sugar with a given yeast can only produce X amount of carbon dioxide (regardless of whether it takes it three days or three weeks). Temperature will however make the yeasty beasties multiply faster and work harder. this is one of the reasons why Reds (should) ferment hotter than white.
          Gluten free, caffeine free, dairy free, fat free – you gotta love this red wine diet!

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          • #6
            Hi

            From what I gather the higher the temp the faster the ferment, hence not putting the wine in the airing cupboards advice I've seen. My thoughts are that the more rapidly the CO2 is produced then this would agitate the wine more and lift more flavour out, but as I'm typing this I'm starting to think about degassing and this rapid expulsion of CO2 would also take out flavour.

            Your comments on temperature seem to make more sense as well as reds need more heat/harder working yeast would explain why the Gervin No. 2 seems to be fast as its meant for red wines.

            I'll have to wait for the taste test and see which I prefer etc.

            Mark...........

            Comment


            • #7
              D47 has been good for me for white juice wines and lychee.. doesn't surprise me that it's slow though.

              Comment


              • #8
                Originally posted by Cellar_Rat View Post
                Are you correlating speed of ferment with temperature? Cooler temperatures tend to keep more flavour & fragrance than hotter ones.
                .
                Hmmmmmmm. So you're saying a slow ferment could enhance the flavour? My wines are taking so much longer to ferment now the weather has dropped and I've always seen this as a bad thing. Would you further your conjecture to say it might only be a good thing at the start of the ferment when most flavours and fragrances are blown off? Most of mine seem to start as normal, but slow to a crawl around the 1010 and lower mark.

                Comment


                • #9
                  Originally posted by Leon View Post
                  Hmmmmmmm. So you're saying a slow ferment could enhance the flavour? My wines are taking so much longer to ferment now the weather has dropped and I've always seen this as a bad thing. Would you further your conjecture to say it might only be a good thing at the start of the ferment when most flavours and fragrances are blown off? Most of mine seem to start as normal, but slow to a crawl around the 1010 and lower mark.
                  There is somewhere in my course notes an interesting graph showing the ethanol conversion across the time of the fermentation. You should aim to get a straight line. In a perfect world you vary the temperature to control the yeast - warm enough to get it started - cooler in the middle to control the explosive yeast population growth (causing a temperature rise and subsequent conversion Spike). finally you then make sure it is warm enough towards the end to get a good finish.

                  I do (attempt) this every year with my Reds and it does make a difference. It also coincides with making sure they don't exceed 32° C

                  does that answer your question?
                  Gluten free, caffeine free, dairy free, fat free – you gotta love this red wine diet!

                  Comment


                  • #10
                    An update,

                    After topping them all up, I've let them settle down and noticed that they all have started to clear to one degree or another. Test the sg last night and hear are the results.

                    Youngs - 0.993
                    Gervin no2 - 0.992
                    Gervin Vat 'D' - 0.992
                    Lalvin D47 - 1.004

                    I think the youngs and both gervin's have all finished and I'll be trying the sg tonight and tomorrow to confirm, the D47 still shows sign of fermenting so given the speed it has shown so far will leave it a bit longer.

                    Mark......

                    Comment


                    • #11
                      HI All

                      Just an update, all the samples have now finished fermenting and had the first taste.

                      The D47 took the longest to ferment with perhaps 2-3 weeks longer than the rest.

                      What I did notice is that they all clear well without and finnings added, probably also due to it been a juice wine as well.

                      So gave a sample to my parents and some friends and there was 4 votes for the youngs (even though I thought the bouquet was off) and one for the D47. Interesting was that the 4 that went for the youngs rated the D47 3rd with the Vat 'D' 2nd. My personnel choice was with the Vat 'D'.

                      One thing that was agreed was that the Gerviin GV2 did not come out well, although I'm not surprised as this is meant to be used with red wines.

                      I think the next step will be to try them in a month or two and see. In addition I think that a pure aldi white grape didn't lend all it's flavour so will try some other juice combo's and do the run again.

                      One big thing I did notice was the difference in taste from using the different yeasts, I must admit I did not expect it to be so dramatic.

                      Mark........

                      Comment


                      • #12
                        I was amazed at the difference when I forst did a similar trial.....

                        Although if you think about it, the yeast is what makes the wine, so differences in it are likely to have the biggest effect.

                        We bring previous vintages to grapefest (well i dont, as its at my house, my wines are already there) and it is amazing to see the differences each winemaker makes to the wine too.

                        looking forward to hearing your findings along the way

                        what a great hobby this is

                        regards
                        Bob
                        N.G.W.B.J.
                        Member of 5 Towns Wine and Beer Makers Society (Yorkshire's newest)
                        Wine, mead and beer maker

                        Comment


                        • #13
                          I was amazed at the difference when I forst did a similar trial.....

                          .... erm, Bob, your Geordie is showing.....
                          Okay, now I get it. The difference between drinkable and ready....

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                          • #14
                            lol

                            Sorry Gadgey....divvunt get radgey
                            N.G.W.B.J.
                            Member of 5 Towns Wine and Beer Makers Society (Yorkshire's newest)
                            Wine, mead and beer maker

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