Alcohol substitute?

[ms67]

I'd also like to note his name "Professor Nutt"...

I wonder which side this guy is really sat on???

wasn't he the guy sacked from the drugs advisory committee, because his advice was completely devoid of political awareness .... i.e. he simply reported the relative harm/lack of harm of various "intoxicating" substances. His continued comparisons to the harm of alcohol/tobacco etc really got up the nose of those who asked for his expert opinion. And didn't he also get a few sympathetic resignations from others on the same committee? or am i confusing him with someone else?

[hedgerow]

Omniata, been there and tried the bad back thing, ouch

I was on dias apan and morphene, but what amazed me was The amount of drugs you need to take to keep you going on those two drugs, it was the same with doing chemo, the amount to tablets 19 a day just to allow you to function whilst they do it is amazing. best bit was spending all day talking to Percy penguin at my bed side, strange how no one else saw him??????

as for the story I realy do think that it is a practical joke and is pure fiction, the amount to money invested in alcahol is just to great. I think you have more chance of being allowed to produce a car engine that does over 100 miles per gallon

[ms67]

the amount to money invested in alcahol is just to great. I think you have more chance of being allowed to produce a car engine that does over 100 miles per gallon

true true true!

on the issue of time spent in hospital, i was on a diamorphine (thats heroin) drip for about a week, then morphine for some time afterwards, then one of those "give yourself a fix" drips when the pain gets bad. In the diamorphine stage i have very few memories. One of which was a very pretty nurse having a benny hill type moment at my bedside at eye-level. Another was the seemingly constant presence of an elderly nurse who was one of the most caring and comforting people i have ever had the pleasure to spend time with. And the last one ...... during a visit from friends i thought a heard a phone ring (before the days of mobiles), i turned sharpley to what i thought was the phone, picked it up, rushed it to my ear, and delivered half a pint of water into it

[goldseal]

wasn't he the guy sacked from the drugs advisory committee, because his advice was completely devoid of political awareness .... i.e. he simply reported the relative harm/lack of harm of various "intoxicating" substances. His continued comparisons to the harm of alcohol/tobacco etc really got up the nose of those who asked for his expert opinion. And didn't he also get a few sympathetic resignations from others on the same committee? or am i confusing him with someone else?

That's him. A classic case of a finding being scientifically sound, but socially unacceptable.

Back to the article - I like the way the author has mixed two unrelated subjects:

1. This stuff is 'better' than alcohol

2. blah thousand people ended up dead / in hospital through alcohol related illness / accidents

As Prof. Nutt has said, there are plenty of other things 'better' than alcohol, if 'better' is defined as 'gives you a high without those nasty side-effects'. If alcohol was 'responsible' for those x thousand hospital cases, the logical conclusion would be to ban alcohol.

We all know it is more complicated than that. Shouldn't this sort of article appear in The Mail?

[ms67]

hehe, quite so!

nothing as queer as folk, as they say!

[wisp]

Interesting responses to this article. The 'pill', as far as I understand it, only comes into play after the user has been drinking. The 'substitute' is used in the drink and the alcohol has been taken out; with the probability of it being used for fuel. The 'buzz' is still there, but taking the pill is supposed to return us to a sober state; so much so, that we are safe to drive.

As for proff. Nutt, I have to admit that I admire him for not simply 'conforming' to the government's wants. I think, too, that he is much admired within the scientific community; to the point of so many other scientists resigning over his sacking. And lets face it, the two most dangerous substances are tobacco and alcohol. I am guilty of using both.

I'm not sure though, as has been mentioned, why this post should be pulled. I thought the article was interesting and figured that Bob and co. needed time to come up with a way of teaching us how to make wine with substitutes for alcohol!

I am attracted to making my own booze because of the history and the country craft feel to the pursuit. When Mrs.wisp and I taste the results we are proud of our creations; although they would never win any prizes. So, I think that we would continue to make wine in the traditional ways nevertheless.

I wonder, however, if there is something to be said for continuing research into this field. If it meant that one of my grandchildren would not be hit by a drunk driver, I would applaud it from the highest rooftop. Imagine if the great George Best had been able to have a wee tipple and keep his health. I think someone brought up the problems of binge drinking.

I'm glad I posted this. So many different points of view. All that remains to be said is "Bob, have you got a Nutt in your address book?"

[ms67]

i'm glad you posted this thread too wisp, so thanks for that. As homebrewers i think our relationship with alcohol (as a drink) is subtly different to your guy or gal down the local, or your work colleagues. For that alone its a good crowd to discuss it with. The perils of straying into politics is, i guess, the reason why it was always a possibility to have it pulled. And that is why the chat didn't go too deep, again guessing. Nevertheless simply seeing pro/con/neutral stances here reveals a little.

As for continuing this line of research i'd say it's a must, and expanding it. Alcohol doesn't suit everyone by far, and doesn't suit many who think it does - which is far worse. Your example of George Best is great; its not just drink/driving, liver damage, brain cell pathogens, or the recent headline grabbing NHS costs due to alcohol. So finding alternatives for that big percentage of the population (globally) is important. People have always sought ways to play, transcend, relax, explore, meditate etc, and they always will - so the more options we have the better.

Thanks again wisp

[goldseal]

I think I agree with you. I just thought the article was a poor piece of work.

[ms67]

bleh, newspapers seldom make a good fist of science, technical or specialist stuff. Some of the broadsheets try, which is something, but as for the rest well a witty headline followed by wild speculation about what it could all mean (usually cure-all-miracle or doomsday), topped up with generous helping of lack of understanding and then stirred with the wrong end of the stick, is about the best you can hope for. Cynical - moi?

[wisp]