Do you stir the lees?

[jojo]

During secondary? Why or why not?

I read it might be good with certain fruits and am searching for more info.

[lockwood1956]

I would stir during primary.....probably twice a day to ensure getting all of the fruit flavour out.

Wouldnt stir during secondary as by that time the fruit pulp should be removed and the lees is just dead yeast hulls, no benefit gained by stirring except to mess it all up.

IMHO (in my honest opinion)

regards
Bob

[Kodiak]

Primary push the cap down.

I only push the cap down 2 to 3 times a day, to prevent bacteria ,and keep an even temp through out the mix.This is for crushed grapes .I don't know what you would do for other types of wine.

Kodiak

[jojo]

OK, so I am reading Kellers web page right now and he says that there is a difference between "solids" and the "lees". He goes to say:

"The lees are important at this stage because many of the live yeast cells will have settled into the lees. Without them, fermentation will get very sluggish or stick (stop altogether). The best procedure is to stir the wine to get the lees into suspension, then pour the liquid through a large funnel into the secondary." (http://winemaking.jackkeller.net/secondary.asp)

I know I am pretty much thinking out loud here, but it seems to me that stirring the secondary lees (as opposed to the solids in primary) is the thing to do. I'm curious about what fruits are better with lees stirred. Anyone got reference/idea?

[Hippie]

Battonage...

Battonage is the method in which the winemaker uses extended lees contact called 'sur lies aging' and stirs the lees every so often so as to not cause a condition called 'autolysis' in which the dead yeast cause a bad taste or odor from rotting. Used with a very subjective yeast choice and malolactic fermentation, it can help create some very nice wines. I only know of using this method in grape wines and have had success with my Scuppernong.

I hope this helped.

[muscadine]

Battonage is the method in which the winemaker uses extended lees contact called 'sur lies aging' and stirs the lees every so often so as to not cause a condition called 'autolysis' in which the dead yeast cause a bad taste or odor form rotting. Used with a very subjective yeast choice and malolactic fermentation, it can help create some very nice wines. I only know of using this method in grape wines and have had success with my Scuppernong.

I hope this helped.

When you stir the lees do you insert somthing into the secondary OR do you just swish it around by shaking the carboy?

[Hippie]

stirring

I use the little square end of my long plastic spoon.

[jojo]

When you stir the lees do you insert somthing into the secondary OR do you just swish it around by shaking the carboy?

I heard a guy in the local brew shop say he did this.

I question the use of the nylon bag. I use it always, but I wonder if not using it or straining the must solids out prior to secondary would make any difference in the end.

Keller writes that active yeast exist in the lees and it is important to "transfer" and not rack from primary to secondary. It seems to me that the use of the bag would affect the lees in this regard some way or another.

I'm overanalyzing.

Moving on......

[jak]

Personally i would not stir or disturb the lees in any way in the secondary fermenter. best left to form a solid mass then rack off into another demi, there should be plent of live yeast cells suspended in the wine.

[lockwood1956]

Keeping the fruit pulp in the nylon bag makes it easier to remove the pulp when done fermenting on it.

This doesn't in any way affect the lees. if you wished (and if Jack Keller recomends it then you really should) you can transfer lees to secondary but not the pulp in the nylon bag, simply remove bag and transfer what is left to secondary. From what i understand (and I could be wrong here, but don't think so) you dont want fruit/grape/vegetable pulp in the secondary.

hope this helps