grape variety "brandt" wine?

[james]

There's a vine that’s growing rampantly in a back lane near my house. It’s loaded with fruit. I've got a feeling it may be "brandt" because of the vigour of growth, the small tightly packed bunches of small blue-black grapes, and the slip-skin nature of the grapes (which I believe is indicative of American species). My only doubt is that I thought brandt had red flesh & juice- this grape does not, it has clear juice and yellow flesh (if anyone knows what colour flesh & juice brandt has, and how tightly packed the bunches are, please let me know....). Some bunches are more mature than others, and some grapes are already tasting sweet.

I'm wondering about the possibility of making wine from these grapes. I've read that vigorous American hybrids can result in musky / foxy wines. So I'm not sure whether making wine is going to be worthwhile.

But I've also read that American species varietal flavours can be reduced if the grapes are harvested young- they reach full varietal foxy flavour at full maturity

Therefore, if I were to make wine from these grapes, I'd probably harvest them slightly young, then crush and press immediately, with the intention of limiting skin contact time with the must (…to create a light dry white wine)

If it is brandt, the parents are probably clinton x black saint Peter (believed to be another name for zinfandel). Clinton is a slipskin, riperia x labrusca; zinfandel is vinifera with red flesh and juice.

Has anyone got any experience of doing this? does it sound plausible?

[fatbloke]

There's a vine that’s growing rampantly in a back lane near my house. It’s loaded with fruit. I've got a feeling it may be "brandt" because of the vigour of growth, the small tightly packed bunches of small blue-black grapes, and the slip-skin nature of the grapes (which I believe is indicative of American species). My only doubt is that I thought brandt had red flesh & juice- this grape does not, it has clear juice and yellow flesh (if anyone knows what colour flesh & juice brandt has, and how tightly packed the bunches are, please let me know....). Some bunches are more mature than others, and some grapes are already tasting sweet.

I'm wondering about the possibility of making wine from these grapes. I've read that vigorous American hybrids can result in musky / foxy wines. So I'm not sure whether making wine is going to be worthwhile.

But I've also read that American species varietal flavours can be reduced if the grapes are harvested young- they reach full varietal foxy flavour at full maturity

Therefore, if I were to make wine from these grapes, I'd probably harvest them slightly young, then crush and press immediately, with the intention of limiting skin contact time with the must (…to create a light dry white wine)

If it is brandt, the parents are probably clinton x black saint Peter (believed to be another name for zinfandel). Clinton is a slipskin, riperia x labrusca; zinfandel is vinifera with red flesh and juice.

Has anyone got any experience of doing this? does it sound plausible?

Damn you learn something new every day.....

I've never heard of "brandt" wine grapes, only the term "brandt wien" from the original Dutch/Flemish being bastardised into english to result in the modern day "brandy".....

Though I'd have thought that as brandt, apparently, meands "burnt" then surely the "genuine article" would have very dark skins, flesh and juice ????????

regards

jtfb

[lockwood1956]

Black Hamburg was the most widely planted black grape vine up till recently, are you sure it isnt a hamburg?

see here for potential help

http://www.vivc.bafz.de/index.php

[james]

Until I tasted a grape a few days ago, I thought it might be black hamburg. However, i dont think it is now because :

1) black hamburg is a later maturing variety (irrc), so wouldnt expect to taste a sweet grape yet on black hamburg.
2) I think the bunches are biger on black hamburg. The bunches on this vine are small at 4 to 5 inches long with no shoulders.
3) black hamburg isnt a slipskin.

brandt was my second choice of likely vines, but it could be anything....


Edit: having looked it up in the bafz database (bob's link above), I've found that I'm spelling it incorrectly. They have no record of "brandt", but do have a record of "brant". Its listed as a wine grape.