Could i ask a question of Bob.. when you say about adding fruit late in the ferment,, is there a certain time to add it, SG wise?? Also a bit more general i guess depending on the wine, what kind of amound would you add, and would you leave it there till the wine has fermented out??

Thanks.
Mark.

The major reason for using Youngs is that it is available from Wilkinsons - we do not have a local home brew shop. Whenever I am out and about and near such shops, I try to stock up on yeasts.

The information provided by you both is brilliant. It can sometimes feel a little overwhelming when reading posts relating to expensive equipment; and it is really nice to read about good honest basics. I agree with you, Bob, regarding good ingredients and good wine; along with the inclusion of techniques added by science.

What might be an idea, is if you post a recipe and method, i would be happy to give advice on improvements to both (if possible)

but to summarise major improvements in wine from the following:

Juice extraction wherever possible (a la Colin Tweed tutorial) so the must is cleaner (unless you need solids for colour extraction)
no hot or boiling water
SO2 for sanitation of must and equipment
Quality yeast, eeking it out if cost is an issue (you cant do this with the yeast compound)
Quality nutrient (i have not yet found a way to do this cheaper.....yet!)
Late fruit addition for fruitier wine


But No 1 reason for good wine, is good ingredients.

one of the biggest changes i have made in my fruit (non grape) ferents, is adding the fruit late....this is not usage of expensive kit, but use of science to make better wine. Through observations it was deterined that the initial part of fermentation, where it was bubbling like crazy, blows a lot of the esthers out of the airlock (these are the wine's bouquet and flavour)

I have a lot of expensive kit at my disposal, but the basic winemaking is the same steps, all i do is remove olde worlde techniques from the process, and it is this that has dramatically improved my winemaking.

Is that what you were alluding to wisp?

or is it something else you seek, let me know and I will endeavor to sort it out for you

I have been thinking of a simple timeline video tutorial covering the basics, and asking form members to contribute,work has started on it already, and a lot of footage will likely be shot at grapefest 2011, but with the addition of potential steps at each stage maybe, and discussion of various techniques. Just because peeps do it differently, doesnt mean they are wrong, as long as they enjoy the process and enjoy the wine, but it is nice to show that there are newer ideas.
cheers
Bob

I see (I think) what you are getting at....

The methodology I use is just modernisation of olde qorlde techniques...

Roughly in this order

Pick the fruit
Prepare the must
Ferment to dry
Stabilise
Sweeten if desired
Store and age
Bottle
Drink

Preparation of the must is where a lot of changes have taken pce...we have great stuff like pectolase and SO2 as winemaking tools, so we no longer need to use boiling water, you can of course still use boiling water to sanitise and process your fruit, but the results will not be as conducive to good wine (stewed taste and release of pectin) both methods get the fruit ready to ferment


Fermentation, the biggest change here is yeast technology, the youngs super yeast compound is a swiss army knife type of affair, designed to give you a product that works well. However using good quality yeast and nutrients will result in a far superior finished product, the main problem for most winemakers is cost, quality yeast running at over one pound per packet. It is worth while of course investing in one good qulity cketnd eeking itout over a season by using the techniques in the "yest starters, all you wanted to know" tutorial.

A little pre knowledge is required really, otherwise it's a bit hit and miss if your results will turn out tasty and drinkable, rather than drinkable only by the sink.

Not really sure what you want by back to basics? Wine#1 doesn't get anymore basic really, you still need a certain amount of 'stuff' to make a drinkable wine.

I've used the youngs wine yeast before with variable results when I was starting out. Since then I learnt to make yeast starters and extend the life of my 1 sachet of posh £1 yeast over several brews.

Have you tried any Lalvin yeast Wisp? I've a few in at the moment and would gladly send you some to try. I think you'll like the results compared to youngs wine yeast compound. The lees get more compact, (IMO) making it much easier to rack, (that might be me being lazy though, and leaving stuff to long before racking)

Okie dokie!

The yeast I was using was a Youngs' all purpose yeast. I've been in touch with Youngs and they have assured me that if one is using their Super Yeast - or whatever it's darned well called - one has to keep in mind that it is a compound.

One of the problems that I have to put aside whilst using WaH is that we are not all experts.

I wonder whether Bob. and co, should be restricted from their usual tools and employ their knowledge working with a minimum budget.

I have every confidence in Bob and co. I know that they will search back to when they began and let us all know how they progressed.

If you are using Youngs oojah, it is 5 teaspoons for five gallons. If you have access, unlike me, to a local home brew shop; it's a sachet full of previously selected yeast that are proven to do the job.

What about it Bob, NW, Gold and the rest of you? Just basics. The hard bit will be forgetting what you know. Start from scratch ... no pre-knowledge.

Looking forward to your posts.

Cheers Bob, I really am most grateful. I'll take a look at the links now.

ohis



this chart is done using the divide by 7.36 formula I outlined earlier, i find it a "near enough" guide

You may find this helpful too

hmmmmm

its likely a little more accurate than subtract finish from start and divide by 7.36

but this way is simpler, and reasonably accurate (or near enoiugh)

if you use 5gm of yeast and make a starter culture with it, you would be fine.

but you must run a side by side yeast comparison, you will likely find the Lalvin yeast will produce far superior wine

The factors were taught to me as a 'given', you just used the formula.

This was a chart a was given. So if my orig sg was 1060 the factor would be 6.82, my orig sg was 1092 so I look up and find that 1090 has a factor of 7.04 - make a small adjustment for the extra two ergo 7.035. I don't think I'm explaining this very well. Do your best to untangle my confusion Bob, will you. The wife has just booked the guys in the white coats for me!!

Is 5gm yeast the same as 5gm yeast compound? Or would I need more as it is not all yeast?

Sorry to so thick. I am grateful for your patience.

Im not sure what you are saying here?

appropriate factor?


and 5gm yeast will do 5 gallons

I subtract finish from start same as you


but I divide by 7.36 giving you 14.13% ABV

its only a guide though

It looks as though I've been using a method of measuring alcohol content that is incorrect.

Years ago I was taught, later confirmed by a website [the Sheffield school of thought], that one took the original sg and subtracted the final sg [ignoring the decimal point] and then dividing it by a given factor that related to the original sg. For instance ...

1092 - 988 = 104/7.035 = 14.783226723525230987917555081734 rounded up = 15%.

The factors [key: original sg - appropriate factor]:

1.010 - 7.59, 1.020 - 7.52, 1.030 -7.45, 1.040 - 7.39, 1.050 - 7.29, 1.060 - 7.20, 1.070 - 7.14, 1.080 -7.09, 1.090 - 7.04, 1.100 - 7.00, 1.110 - 6.96, 1.120 - 6.93, 1.130 - 6.90, 1.140 - 6.87, 1.150 - 6.84, 1.060 - 6.82.

Needless to say, I have lost a lot of confidence and I am wondering where to begin. Is this method totally wrong?

Any guidance that any of you can give would be greatly appreciated.

In other words HEEEEELLLLPPP!

Cheers.